Discussion:
Comments on the Guilt of Atonement
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f***@beethoven.com
2005-05-20 05:28:13 UTC
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Following some of the ideas and radical interpretations in the essay
"Guilt of Atonement" and "Sterens, Knowledge Revealed", it is
interesting to

Fabrizio J Bonsignore, now Danilo J BOnsignore
f***@beethoven.com
2005-05-20 22:37:48 UTC
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***@beethoven.com wrote:
Following some of the ideas and radical interpretations in the essay
"Guilt of Atonement" and "Sterens, Knowledge Revealed", it is
interesting to (mouse error)

note how modern images in actual Biblical material are in actual
contradiction with literal interpretations, to the point that it can be
said that values have been inverted! (though not in the Nitzchean
sense). I want to note four instances, two in the Old Testament and two
in the New Testament that go against what is commonly understood and
repeated as a matter of fact in the icons and symbols of the Occidental
world. These ideas are derived from the understanding that, first, from
a humanist point of view the sacrifice of Jesus is under all
considerations a historical mistake (just given the sheer fact of the
pain inflicted to an living being, and human), and the simple issue
raised by the Bible of the existence or possibility of immortality.
[Some speculations can be found in the threads of Futures of Man in
these same groups].

Fabrizio J Bonsignore, now Danilo J BOnsignore
f***@beethoven.com
2005-05-22 18:54:53 UTC
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First I want to comment about onanism, one of the most amazing
religious constructions ever.

Fabrizio J Bonsignore, now Danilo J BOnsignore
f***@beethoven.com
2005-06-01 13:26:55 UTC
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Post by f***@beethoven.com
First I want to comment about onanism, one of the most amazing
religious constructions ever.
This may be similar to some positions of Mircea Eliade or maybe remind
Foucault: any religious statement is in its basis a sexual statement,
since Religion has to do with the Afterlife and Life, Life and the
Afterlife, and Death, which are all inextricably linked (like a real
three threaded golden bough) with the basic act of sexuality to Life,
in a now eternal circular argument, that of the egg and the hen (or the
hen and the egg?). A simultaneous equation solving all variables at the
same time!

Danilo J Bonsignore then Fabrizio J Bonsignore again Danilo J Bonsignore
f***@beethoven.com
2005-06-14 23:15:31 UTC
Permalink
This may be similar to some positions of Mircea Eliade or maybe remind
Foucault: any religious statement is in its basis a sexual statement,
since Religion has to do with the Afterlife and Life, Life and the
Afterlife, and Death, which are all inextricably linked (like a real
three threaded golden bough) with the basic act of sexuality to Life,
in a now eternal circular argument, that of the egg and the hen (or the
hen and the egg?). A simultaneous equation solving all variables at the
same time!

Onanism is most peculiar (don't confuse with homosexuality, sexual
arousing with individuals of the same sex, or self-penetration, sexual
experimentation with your _own_ body) since it actually turns into a
*sin* avoiding sexual relations with a woman who is not a wife! It has
a very procreation-oriented intention in an epoch when birth rights and
parenthood were essential to the economical state of things, as
distribution through the market was limited at the time, but it also
recognized, more subconsciouly than consciously maybe, that once a
couple is formed as it comes to gene spreading sisters are as good as
the orignal wife, as gene combinations (babies) will be quite similar!
ONly few differences actually, once a couple decides to mix genes. Why
not brothers? It certainly has to do with economic intergenerational
distribution of goods passing from generation to generation within the
lines of a patriarchal society. But in our times the simple idea of a
man having as sexual partners the sisters of his wife sounds as almost
a matter of revenge and drama if not of tragedy! LOts f conflicts would
have been avoided by men of the era by NOT engaging in onanism... And
yet today this holy book is still guide to many...

Danilo J Bonsignore then Fabrizio J Bonsignore again Danilo J Bonsignore
the ram arm
2005-06-01 17:42:48 UTC
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"And Yahve had 72 names, for he was a Creator but his Equals were
jealous of Him, were afraid and finding his creatures at fault tried to
destroy them and hide and deny Him. Yet there was One who was not
afraid, and daring His wrath and jealousy and the wrath of the Others
imposed his Will on the new creatures. And so began the fight between
the two Sides, which came to be known as Good and Evil by the
creatures..."

"...for I the LORD thy God [am] a jealous God..."

Danilo J. BOnsignore then Fabrizio J Bonsignore again Danilo J.
Bonsignore
("Danielo Bonsignor" the whistler)
f***@beethoven.com
2005-06-01 01:08:20 UTC
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A comment posted in another thread. See the "Chin Chin Mechanism"
thread.

That "Christ died for our sins" means that he was punished for other's
deeds! So he didn't died *for* us, he died *by* us. He received a kiss
of betrayal, had to be identified and distinguished from the twelve and
this identity was disambiguated so that he died by what the others did!
"For *our* sins" it means because of the sins of the others not Christ,
so he did nothing, he was innocent and it was the others who did
whatever was done. Many accusers, one victim, the victim is innocent...
f***@beethoven.com
2005-06-01 02:05:12 UTC
Permalink
Post by f***@beethoven.com
A comment posted in another thread. See the "Chin Chin Mechanism"
thread.
That "Christ died for our sins" means that he was punished for other's
deeds! So he didn't died *for* us, he died *by* us. He received a kiss
of betrayal, had to be identified and distinguished from the twelve and
this identity was disambiguated so that he died by what the others did!
"For *our* sins" it means because of the sins of the others not Christ,
so he did nothing, he was innocent and it was the others who did
whatever was done. Many accusers, one victim, the victim is innocent...
This is what is meant by the lamb washing the sins of this world: a
scapegoat actually, cleaning the real "sinners", criminals, leaving
them clean of crime as all crimes are adjudicated to the lamb (though
in depictions it usually looks more goatish than lambish)

Danilo J. Bonsignore then Fabrizio J. Bonsignore now Danilo J.
Bonsignore
f***@beethoven.com
2005-06-13 17:09:46 UTC
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Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
A comment posted in another thread. See the "Chin Chin Mechanism"
thread.
That "Christ died for our sins" means that he was punished for other's
deeds! So he didn't died *for* us, he died *by* us. He received a kiss
of betrayal, had to be identified and distinguished from the twelve and
this identity was disambiguated so that he died by what the others did!
"For *our* sins" it means because of the sins of the others not Christ,
so he did nothing, he was innocent and it was the others who did
whatever was done. Many accusers, one victim, the victim is innocent...
This is what is meant by the lamb washing the sins of this world: a
scapegoat actually, cleaning the real "sinners", criminals, leaving
them clean of crime as all crimes are adjudicated to the lamb (though
in depictions it usually looks more goatish than lambish)
Danilo J. Bonsignore then Fabrizio J. Bonsignore now Danilo J.
Bonsignore
I am all of them at the same time. And not Them but Them too. This can
only be explained in Time.

Fabrizio J Bonsignore now Danilo J. Bonsignore
f***@beethoven.com
2005-06-13 23:46:30 UTC
Permalink
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
A comment posted in another thread. See the "Chin Chin Mechanism"
thread.
That "Christ died for our sins" means that he was punished for other's
deeds! So he didn't died *for* us, he died *by* us. He received a kiss
of betrayal, had to be identified and distinguished from the twelve and
this identity was disambiguated so that he died by what the others did!
"For *our* sins" it means because of the sins of the others not Christ,
so he did nothing, he was innocent and it was the others who did
whatever was done. Many accusers, one victim, the victim is innocent...
This is what is meant by the lamb washing the sins of this world: a
scapegoat actually, cleaning the real "sinners", criminals, leaving
them clean of crime as all crimes are adjudicated to the lamb (though
in depictions it usually looks more goatish than lambish)
Danilo J. Bonsignore then Fabrizio J. Bonsignore now Danilo J.
Bonsignore
I am all of them at the same time. And not Them but Them too. This can
only be explained in Time.
Fabrizio J Bonsignore now Danilo J. Bonsignore
"Forgive them, for they don't know what they are doing" - Christ

The possibility of telepathy is also the possibility that thoughts can
be "imprinted" on other brains. Given that a thought is a dynamic
series of neurone activations, that is, a series of neurones triggering
a signal or inhibiting themselves in a certain pattern that is *more or
less* repeated in every time the same thought is generated (to another
_set_ of activations which actually receives it as input as
"recognizes" it), a given dynamic signal can actually affect the
pattern of activations, making the thought *change* according to that
signal. If the signal is strong enough it may even *_suplant_* the
original signal or force a series of activations that would be
considered as being that thought, *even if the thought has not been
generated*!...

Danilo J Bonsignore then Fabrizio J Bonsignore now Danilo J Bonsignore
f***@beethoven.com
2005-06-27 14:22:35 UTC
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How do they want a heavenly afterlife if they cannot make this life
heavenly? It was the Kingdom of God *ON* Earth, wasn't it?

Fabrizio J Bonsignore now Danilo Jose Bonsignore

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