Discussion:
The chin chin mechanism (or be damned yourself)
(too old to reply)
f***@beethoven.com
2005-05-15 13:29:06 UTC
Permalink
I attempted a formal language to explain without ambiguities how the
confusion of identities works when, in spoken and even written language
it is impossible to disambiguate the confusion, as the phrase 'A is
(really" B' works for both identities. Yet this is but one of
various mechanism that can be used to exchange people. They are called
mechanisms since once established they operate automatically; once the
initial confusion is seeded it is just a matter of applying the same
operation, and no matter how the victim reacts he/she will be subject
to the effect of the mechanism, as long as the initial assumptions are
considered true.

The most simplified mechanism, employed by the Mexican armed forces
(includiing the various polices), is the "chin chin", also knows as "la
tuya"; (yours) or "all you say is backwards" (refers to you). I may
have already exposed it somewhere else, but I here I want to make it
explicit that the mechanism works under two conditions:

a) the party applying it has authority (authority fallacy or ad
baculum, asuming trth is derived from authority irrespective of
deductive logic)
b)the party applying it is committing the crimes or offenses that will
be blamed on the victim

Both conditions are necessary to apply successfully the mechanism,
condition a) to be believed and condition b) to incriminate. It only
makes sense to apply it for criminal activities, not for positive
achievements, through the existence of positive works makes it more
profitable and often the motivation to apply it. (Note: this confusion
works best when dealing between countries, if the accusing country
establishes a false identity for the victim from the outset, as the
innocent victim will appear like he/she is committing a fraud).

But what really makes it work is to make the victim *hook* into the
mechanism through "self-incrimination". To make it credible, there are
a few paths:

1) inform the victim of all crimes committed to force him to deny them
('I didn't do it!')
2) take the victim's words and make them true in a criminal way
3) make criminals protect the victim, so that he/she appears as being
an accomplice and/or as a traitor to the criminal bands.

The first path is rather tricky, as it involves informing the victim in
such a way he/she cannot accuse back. But once the suspicions that he
may be incriminated is seeded, the second path is easier, as there will
be a natural incentive to explain and prevent the undesirable
consequences. This incrimination works under the assumption that
*raising an issue means admittance of guilt*. And once this assumption
is in place there is no way the victim can prove himself innocent!
Formally this has the meaning of a double closure. In one hand, at the
beginning of the process of applying the mechanism, the victim is in a
"point state", a closure reduced to one point, where even
mentioning the fact is "dangerous". But once the issue is exposed, then
a second idempotent closure operates in which any action gives the same
result: proof of guilt. Again, these mechanisms act as long as the
accuser is believed to be true and honest by virtue of being an
authority. This condition is essential, since basically it is the
accuser who gathers the evidence, and evidence can be easily forged,
particularly if the whole process is planned in advance. For instance,
it is easy to collect evidence in advance and pretend it was found in
the scene of the crime, including but not limited to corporal debris,
fingerprints, objects left behind or stolen (small and apparently
innocuous, the kind that are not reported to the police), etc.

So the chin chin closure works by an authority taking the victim's acts
and committing crimes around them, with the supporting evidence
gathered as necessary to pretend that the victim is guilty,
particularly when the victim is accusing the victimizers! Obviously,
this can be accompanied with the same arguments applied to other
people, other victims, either by convincing ("sensible"
reinterpretation making innocence appear as being contrived) or by
threats, bribes, etc.

The moral of this essay is that when it comes to dennounce crimes all
aprties involved become automatically suspicious! But, particularly,
the authority, as the simple fact of being authority lends it moral
weight which may not be really warranted. As always, moral probity is a
difficult issue but cannot be taken for granted.

Fabrizio J BOnsignore, now Danilo J Bonsignore
f***@beethoven.com
2005-05-15 14:15:33 UTC
Permalink
Post by f***@beethoven.com
I attempted a formal language to explain without ambiguities how the
confusion of identities works when, in spoken and even written
language
Post by f***@beethoven.com
it is impossible to disambiguate the confusion, as the phrase 'A is
(really" B' works for both identities. Yet this is but one of
various mechanism that can be used to exchange people. They are called
mechanisms since once established they operate automatically; once the
initial confusion is seeded it is just a matter of applying the same
operation, and no matter how the victim reacts he/she will be subject
to the effect of the mechanism, as long as the initial assumptions are
considered true.
The most simplified mechanism, employed by the Mexican armed forces
(includiing the various polices), is the "chin chin", also knows as "la
tuya"; (yours) or "all you say is backwards" (refers to you). I may
have already exposed it somewhere else, but I here I want to make it
a) the party applying it has authority (authority fallacy or ad
baculum, asuming trth is derived from authority irrespective of
deductive logic)
b)the party applying it is committing the crimes or offenses that will
be blamed on the victim
Both conditions are necessary to apply successfully the mechanism,
condition a) to be believed and condition b) to incriminate. It only
makes sense to apply it for criminal activities, not for positive
achievements, through the existence of positive works makes it more
profitable and often the motivation to apply it. (Note: this
confusion
Post by f***@beethoven.com
works best when dealing between countries, if the accusing country
establishes a false identity for the victim from the outset, as the
innocent victim will appear like he/she is committing a fraud).
But what really makes it work is to make the victim *hook* into the
mechanism through "self-incrimination". To make it credible, there are
1) inform the victim of all crimes committed to force him to deny them
('I didn't do it!')
2) take the victim's words and make them true in a criminal way
3) make criminals protect the victim, so that he/she appears as being
an accomplice and/or as a traitor to the criminal bands.
The first path is rather tricky, as it involves informing the victim in
such a way he/she cannot accuse back. But once the suspicions that he
may be incriminated is seeded, the second path is easier, as there will
be a natural incentive to explain and prevent the undesirable
consequences. This incrimination works under the assumption that
*raising an issue means admittance of guilt*. And once this
assumption
Post by f***@beethoven.com
is in place there is no way the victim can prove himself innocent!
Formally this has the meaning of a double closure. In one hand, at the
beginning of the process of applying the mechanism, the victim is in a
"point state", a closure reduced to one point, where even
mentioning the fact is "dangerous". But once the issue is exposed, then
a second idempotent closure operates in which any action gives the same
result: proof of guilt. Again, these mechanisms act as long as the
accuser is believed to be true and honest by virtue of being an
authority. This condition is essential, since basically it is the
accuser who gathers the evidence, and evidence can be easily forged,
particularly if the whole process is planned in advance. For
instance,
Post by f***@beethoven.com
it is easy to collect evidence in advance and pretend it was found in
the scene of the crime, including but not limited to corporal debris,
fingerprints, objects left behind or stolen (small and apparently
innocuous, the kind that are not reported to the police), etc.
So the chin chin closure works by an authority taking the victim's acts
and committing crimes around them, with the supporting evidence
gathered as necessary to pretend that the victim is guilty,
particularly when the victim is accusing the victimizers! Obviously,
this can be accompanied with the same arguments applied to other
people, other victims, either by convincing ("sensible"
reinterpretation making innocence appear as being contrived) or by
threats, bribes, etc.
The moral of this essay is that when it comes to dennounce crimes all
aprties involved become automatically suspicious! But, particularly,
the authority, as the simple fact of being authority lends it moral
weight which may not be really warranted. As always, moral probity is a
difficult issue but cannot be taken for granted.
Fabrizio J BOnsignore, now Danilo J Bonsignore
Not really part of the mechanism, but other trick they use is that of
making huge deposits to the victim's name in bank accounts he has no
access to, while at the same time using criminality to ruin him/her.
Then they can claim that his monies were confiscated, while the victim
is defenseless after being ruined with criminality! [They say this is
being done to me by Mota Sanchez from Mexico. Don't know the name of
the people behind my "bad fortune". And Lu is Bis train (Gon zalez) is
also implied, (he is Mexican, not confuse him with a probable cousin
who is American)]

Fabrizio J Bonsignore, now Danilo J Bonsignore
f***@beethoven.com
2005-05-17 17:58:22 UTC
Permalink
Post by f***@beethoven.com
I attempted a formal language to explain without ambiguities how the
confusion of identities works when, in spoken and even written
language
Post by f***@beethoven.com
it is impossible to disambiguate the confusion, as the phrase 'A is
(really" B' works for both identities. Yet this is but one of
various mechanism that can be used to exchange people. They are called
mechanisms since once established they operate automatically; once the
initial confusion is seeded it is just a matter of applying the same
operation, and no matter how the victim reacts he/she will be subject
to the effect of the mechanism, as long as the initial assumptions are
considered true.
The most simplified mechanism, employed by the Mexican armed forces
(includiing the various polices), is the "chin chin", also knows as "la
tuya"; (yours) or "all you say is backwards" (refers to you). I may
have already exposed it somewhere else, but I here I want to make it
a) the party applying it has authority (authority fallacy or ad
baculum, asuming trth is derived from authority irrespective of
deductive logic)
b)the party applying it is committing the crimes or offenses that will
be blamed on the victim
Both conditions are necessary to apply successfully the mechanism,
condition a) to be believed and condition b) to incriminate. It only
makes sense to apply it for criminal activities, not for positive
achievements, through the existence of positive works makes it more
profitable and often the motivation to apply it. (Note: this
confusion
Post by f***@beethoven.com
works best when dealing between countries, if the accusing country
establishes a false identity for the victim from the outset, as the
innocent victim will appear like he/she is committing a fraud).
But what really makes it work is to make the victim *hook* into the
mechanism through "self-incrimination". To make it credible, there are
1) inform the victim of all crimes committed to force him to deny them
('I didn't do it!')
2) take the victim's words and make them true in a criminal way
3) make criminals protect the victim, so that he/she appears as being
an accomplice and/or as a traitor to the criminal bands.
The first path is rather tricky, as it involves informing the victim in
such a way he/she cannot accuse back. But once the suspicions that he
may be incriminated is seeded, the second path is easier, as there will
be a natural incentive to explain and prevent the undesirable
consequences. This incrimination works under the assumption that
*raising an issue means admittance of guilt*. And once this
assumption
Post by f***@beethoven.com
is in place there is no way the victim can prove himself innocent!
Formally this has the meaning of a double closure. In one hand, at the
beginning of the process of applying the mechanism, the victim is in a
"point state", a closure reduced to one point, where even
mentioning the fact is "dangerous". But once the issue is exposed, then
a second idempotent closure operates in which any action gives the same
result: proof of guilt. Again, these mechanisms act as long as the
accuser is believed to be true and honest by virtue of being an
authority. This condition is essential, since basically it is the
accuser who gathers the evidence, and evidence can be easily forged,
particularly if the whole process is planned in advance. For
instance,
Post by f***@beethoven.com
it is easy to collect evidence in advance and pretend it was found in
the scene of the crime, including but not limited to corporal debris,
fingerprints, objects left behind or stolen (small and apparently
innocuous, the kind that are not reported to the police), etc.
[It would be a cover, a tautology, not a closure, once the issue is
raised and the victim ends up being guilty no matter what; yet, if
there is a clearly established hypothesis of what indeed happened and a
clear exit for innocence before testing the hypothesis *and* a
dateline, then the basic good intention of the police can be accepted
as fact, because then the victim will be able to establish his
innocence; in other words, unless this conditions aren't met, the
victim has already been judged as guilty; this should be even more
important when dealing with international accusations: any
investigation has to be *fully* accomplished before any accusation;
investigating while observing and accusing is becoming accoplices by
letting do in case the victim is really guilty, or being inquisitorial
in case the victim is really innocent and the policehas criminal or
political intentions.]
Post by f***@beethoven.com
So the chin chin closure works by an authority taking the victim's acts
and committing crimes around them, with the supporting evidence
gathered as necessary to pretend that the victim is guilty,
particularly when the victim is accusing the victimizers! Obviously,
this can be accompanied with the same arguments applied to other
people, other victims, either by convincing ("sensible"
reinterpretation making innocence appear as being contrived) or by
threats, bribes, etc.
The moral of this essay is that when it comes to dennounce crimes all
aprties involved become automatically suspicious! But, particularly,
the authority, as the simple fact of being authority lends it moral
weight which may not be really warranted. As always, moral probity is a
difficult issue but cannot be taken for granted.
Fabrizio J BOnsignore, now Danilo J Bonsignore
This essay is linked to the Double Entendre thread. The double entendre
in this case is a form of subtle identity theft.

Fabrizio J BOnsignore, now Danilo J Bonsignore
f***@beethoven.com
2005-05-21 22:30:16 UTC
Permalink
As one of the tools applied in these mechanisms, it is possible to
setup pictures with similar;y looking people, taking advantage of the
granularity of films and lights and setups! Anybody can suddenly find
him/herself in pictures they know were never taken...
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
I attempted a formal language to explain without ambiguities how the
confusion of identities works when, in spoken and even written
language
Post by f***@beethoven.com
it is impossible to disambiguate the confusion, as the phrase 'A is
(really" B' works for both identities. Yet this is but one of
various mechanism that can be used to exchange people. They are
called
Post by f***@beethoven.com
mechanisms since once established they operate automatically; once
the
Post by f***@beethoven.com
initial confusion is seeded it is just a matter of applying the same
operation, and no matter how the victim reacts he/she will be subject
to the effect of the mechanism, as long as the initial assumptions
are
Post by f***@beethoven.com
considered true.
The most simplified mechanism, employed by the Mexican armed forces
(includiing the various polices), is the "chin chin", also knows as
"la
Post by f***@beethoven.com
tuya"; (yours) or "all you say is backwards" (refers to you). I may
have already exposed it somewhere else, but I here I want to make it
a) the party applying it has authority (authority fallacy or ad
baculum, asuming trth is derived from authority irrespective of
deductive logic)
b)the party applying it is committing the crimes or offenses that
will
Post by f***@beethoven.com
be blamed on the victim
Both conditions are necessary to apply successfully the mechanism,
condition a) to be believed and condition b) to incriminate. It only
makes sense to apply it for criminal activities, not for positive
achievements, through the existence of positive works makes it more
profitable and often the motivation to apply it. (Note: this
confusion
Post by f***@beethoven.com
works best when dealing between countries, if the accusing country
establishes a false identity for the victim from the outset, as the
innocent victim will appear like he/she is committing a fraud).
But what really makes it work is to make the victim *hook* into the
mechanism through "self-incrimination". To make it credible, there
are
Post by f***@beethoven.com
1) inform the victim of all crimes committed to force him to deny
them
Post by f***@beethoven.com
('I didn't do it!')
2) take the victim's words and make them true in a criminal way
3) make criminals protect the victim, so that he/she appears as being
an accomplice and/or as a traitor to the criminal bands.
The first path is rather tricky, as it involves informing the
victim
Post by f***@beethoven.com
in
Post by f***@beethoven.com
such a way he/she cannot accuse back. But once the suspicions that he
may be incriminated is seeded, the second path is easier, as there
will
Post by f***@beethoven.com
be a natural incentive to explain and prevent the undesirable
consequences. This incrimination works under the assumption that
*raising an issue means admittance of guilt*. And once this
assumption
Post by f***@beethoven.com
is in place there is no way the victim can prove himself innocent!
Formally this has the meaning of a double closure. In one hand, at
the
Post by f***@beethoven.com
beginning of the process of applying the mechanism, the victim is
in
Post by f***@beethoven.com
a
Post by f***@beethoven.com
"point state", a closure reduced to one point, where even
mentioning the fact is "dangerous". But once the issue is exposed,
then
Post by f***@beethoven.com
a second idempotent closure operates in which any action gives the
same
Post by f***@beethoven.com
result: proof of guilt. Again, these mechanisms act as long as the
accuser is believed to be true and honest by virtue of being an
authority. This condition is essential, since basically it is the
accuser who gathers the evidence, and evidence can be easily
forged,
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
particularly if the whole process is planned in advance. For
instance,
Post by f***@beethoven.com
it is easy to collect evidence in advance and pretend it was found in
the scene of the crime, including but not limited to corporal debris,
fingerprints, objects left behind or stolen (small and apparently
innocuous, the kind that are not reported to the police), etc.
[It would be a cover, a tautology, not a closure, once the issue is
raised and the victim ends up being guilty no matter what; yet, if
there is a clearly established hypothesis of what indeed happened and a
clear exit for innocence before testing the hypothesis *and* a
dateline, then the basic good intention of the police can be accepted
as fact, because then the victim will be able to establish his
innocence; in other words, unless this conditions aren't met, the
victim has already been judged as guilty; this should be even more
important when dealing with international accusations: any
investigation has to be *fully* accomplished before any accusation;
investigating while observing and accusing is becoming accoplices by
letting do in case the victim is really guilty, or being
inquisitorial
Post by f***@beethoven.com
in case the victim is really innocent and the policehas criminal or
political intentions.]
Post by f***@beethoven.com
So the chin chin closure works by an authority taking the victim's
acts
Post by f***@beethoven.com
and committing crimes around them, with the supporting evidence
gathered as necessary to pretend that the victim is guilty,
particularly when the victim is accusing the victimizers!
Obviously,
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
this can be accompanied with the same arguments applied to other
people, other victims, either by convincing ("sensible"
reinterpretation making innocence appear as being contrived) or by
threats, bribes, etc.
The moral of this essay is that when it comes to dennounce crimes all
aprties involved become automatically suspicious! But,
particularly,
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
the authority, as the simple fact of being authority lends it moral
weight which may not be really warranted. As always, moral probity
is
Post by f***@beethoven.com
a
Post by f***@beethoven.com
difficult issue but cannot be taken for granted.
Fabrizio J BOnsignore, now Danilo J Bonsignore
This essay is linked to the Double Entendre thread. The double
entendre
Post by f***@beethoven.com
in this case is a form of subtle identity theft.
Fabrizio J BOnsignore, now Danilo J Bonsignore
f***@beethoven.com
2005-05-24 14:40:53 UTC
Permalink
Anotyhe application of the chin chin mechanism and simlar which I
overlooked consistently is the use of the past tenmse to actually mean
the future and viceversa. That way, you are being threatened and since
you take what is said as being already done, you don't take
precautions, so you essentially let it happen. It thwarts decision
making badly...

Fabrizio J Bonsignore, now Danilo J Bonsignore
Post by f***@beethoven.com
As one of the tools applied in these mechanisms, it is possible to
setup pictures with similar;y looking people, taking advantage of the
granularity of films and lights and setups! Anybody can suddenly find
him/herself in pictures they know were never taken...
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
I attempted a formal language to explain without ambiguities how
the
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
confusion of identities works when, in spoken and even written
language
Post by f***@beethoven.com
it is impossible to disambiguate the confusion, as the phrase 'A is
(really" B' works for both identities. Yet this is but one of
various mechanism that can be used to exchange people. They are
called
Post by f***@beethoven.com
mechanisms since once established they operate automatically; once
the
Post by f***@beethoven.com
initial confusion is seeded it is just a matter of applying the
same
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
operation, and no matter how the victim reacts he/she will be
subject
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
to the effect of the mechanism, as long as the initial
assumptions
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
are
Post by f***@beethoven.com
considered true.
The most simplified mechanism, employed by the Mexican armed forces
(includiing the various polices), is the "chin chin", also knows as
"la
Post by f***@beethoven.com
tuya"; (yours) or "all you say is backwards" (refers to you). I may
have already exposed it somewhere else, but I here I want to make
it
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
a) the party applying it has authority (authority fallacy or ad
baculum, asuming trth is derived from authority irrespective of
deductive logic)
b)the party applying it is committing the crimes or offenses that
will
Post by f***@beethoven.com
be blamed on the victim
Both conditions are necessary to apply successfully the
mechanism,
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
condition a) to be believed and condition b) to incriminate. It
only
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
makes sense to apply it for criminal activities, not for positive
achievements, through the existence of positive works makes it more
profitable and often the motivation to apply it. (Note: this
confusion
Post by f***@beethoven.com
works best when dealing between countries, if the accusing
country
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
establishes a false identity for the victim from the outset, as the
innocent victim will appear like he/she is committing a fraud).
But what really makes it work is to make the victim *hook* into the
mechanism through "self-incrimination". To make it credible, there
are
Post by f***@beethoven.com
1) inform the victim of all crimes committed to force him to deny
them
Post by f***@beethoven.com
('I didn't do it!')
2) take the victim's words and make them true in a criminal way
3) make criminals protect the victim, so that he/she appears as
being
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
an accomplice and/or as a traitor to the criminal bands.
The first path is rather tricky, as it involves informing the
victim
Post by f***@beethoven.com
in
Post by f***@beethoven.com
such a way he/she cannot accuse back. But once the suspicions
that
Post by f***@beethoven.com
he
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
may be incriminated is seeded, the second path is easier, as there
will
Post by f***@beethoven.com
be a natural incentive to explain and prevent the undesirable
consequences. This incrimination works under the assumption that
*raising an issue means admittance of guilt*. And once this
assumption
Post by f***@beethoven.com
is in place there is no way the victim can prove himself
innocent!
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Formally this has the meaning of a double closure. In one hand, at
the
Post by f***@beethoven.com
beginning of the process of applying the mechanism, the victim is
in
Post by f***@beethoven.com
a
Post by f***@beethoven.com
"point state", a closure reduced to one point, where even
mentioning the fact is "dangerous". But once the issue is
exposed,
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
then
Post by f***@beethoven.com
a second idempotent closure operates in which any action gives the
same
Post by f***@beethoven.com
result: proof of guilt. Again, these mechanisms act as long as the
accuser is believed to be true and honest by virtue of being an
authority. This condition is essential, since basically it is the
accuser who gathers the evidence, and evidence can be easily
forged,
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
particularly if the whole process is planned in advance. For
instance,
Post by f***@beethoven.com
it is easy to collect evidence in advance and pretend it was
found
Post by f***@beethoven.com
in
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
the scene of the crime, including but not limited to corporal
debris,
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
fingerprints, objects left behind or stolen (small and apparently
innocuous, the kind that are not reported to the police), etc.
[It would be a cover, a tautology, not a closure, once the issue is
raised and the victim ends up being guilty no matter what; yet, if
there is a clearly established hypothesis of what indeed happened
and
Post by f***@beethoven.com
a
Post by f***@beethoven.com
clear exit for innocence before testing the hypothesis *and* a
dateline, then the basic good intention of the police can be
accepted
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
as fact, because then the victim will be able to establish his
innocence; in other words, unless this conditions aren't met, the
victim has already been judged as guilty; this should be even more
important when dealing with international accusations: any
investigation has to be *fully* accomplished before any accusation;
investigating while observing and accusing is becoming accoplices by
letting do in case the victim is really guilty, or being
inquisitorial
Post by f***@beethoven.com
in case the victim is really innocent and the policehas criminal or
political intentions.]
Post by f***@beethoven.com
So the chin chin closure works by an authority taking the
victim's
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
acts
Post by f***@beethoven.com
and committing crimes around them, with the supporting evidence
gathered as necessary to pretend that the victim is guilty,
particularly when the victim is accusing the victimizers!
Obviously,
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
this can be accompanied with the same arguments applied to other
people, other victims, either by convincing ("sensible"
reinterpretation making innocence appear as being contrived) or by
threats, bribes, etc.
The moral of this essay is that when it comes to dennounce crimes
all
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
aprties involved become automatically suspicious! But,
particularly,
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
the authority, as the simple fact of being authority lends it moral
weight which may not be really warranted. As always, moral
probity
Post by f***@beethoven.com
is
Post by f***@beethoven.com
a
Post by f***@beethoven.com
difficult issue but cannot be taken for granted.
Fabrizio J BOnsignore, now Danilo J Bonsignore
This essay is linked to the Double Entendre thread. The double
entendre
Post by f***@beethoven.com
in this case is a form of subtle identity theft.
Fabrizio J BOnsignore, now Danilo J Bonsignore
f***@beethoven.com
2005-05-25 18:49:33 UTC
Permalink
"He himself implied": an expression of the chin chin mechanism after
informing of a future "reality" in the past tense...

Fabrizio J Bonsignore, now Danilo J Bonsignore
Post by f***@beethoven.com
As one of the tools applied in these mechanisms, it is possible to
setup pictures with similar;y looking people, taking advantage of the
granularity of films and lights and setups! Anybody can suddenly find
him/herself in pictures they know were never taken...
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
I attempted a formal language to explain without ambiguities how
the
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
confusion of identities works when, in spoken and even written
language
Post by f***@beethoven.com
it is impossible to disambiguate the confusion, as the phrase 'A is
(really" B' works for both identities. Yet this is but one of
various mechanism that can be used to exchange people. They are
called
Post by f***@beethoven.com
mechanisms since once established they operate automatically; once
the
Post by f***@beethoven.com
initial confusion is seeded it is just a matter of applying the
same
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
operation, and no matter how the victim reacts he/she will be
subject
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
to the effect of the mechanism, as long as the initial assumptions
are
Post by f***@beethoven.com
considered true.
The most simplified mechanism, employed by the Mexican armed forces
(includiing the various polices), is the "chin chin", also knows as
"la
Post by f***@beethoven.com
tuya"; (yours) or "all you say is backwards" (refers to you). I may
have already exposed it somewhere else, but I here I want to make
it
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
a) the party applying it has authority (authority fallacy or ad
baculum, asuming trth is derived from authority irrespective of
deductive logic)
b)the party applying it is committing the crimes or offenses that
will
Post by f***@beethoven.com
be blamed on the victim
Both conditions are necessary to apply successfully the mechanism,
condition a) to be believed and condition b) to incriminate. It
only
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
makes sense to apply it for criminal activities, not for positive
achievements, through the existence of positive works makes it more
profitable and often the motivation to apply it. (Note: this
confusion
Post by f***@beethoven.com
works best when dealing between countries, if the accusing country
establishes a false identity for the victim from the outset, as the
innocent victim will appear like he/she is committing a fraud).
But what really makes it work is to make the victim *hook* into the
mechanism through "self-incrimination". To make it credible, there
are
Post by f***@beethoven.com
1) inform the victim of all crimes committed to force him to deny
them
Post by f***@beethoven.com
('I didn't do it!')
2) take the victim's words and make them true in a criminal way
3) make criminals protect the victim, so that he/she appears as
being
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
an accomplice and/or as a traitor to the criminal bands.
The first path is rather tricky, as it involves informing the
victim
Post by f***@beethoven.com
in
Post by f***@beethoven.com
such a way he/she cannot accuse back. But once the suspicions that
he
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
may be incriminated is seeded, the second path is easier, as there
will
Post by f***@beethoven.com
be a natural incentive to explain and prevent the undesirable
consequences. This incrimination works under the assumption that
*raising an issue means admittance of guilt*. And once this
assumption
Post by f***@beethoven.com
is in place there is no way the victim can prove himself innocent!
Formally this has the meaning of a double closure. In one hand, at
the
Post by f***@beethoven.com
beginning of the process of applying the mechanism, the victim is
in
Post by f***@beethoven.com
a
Post by f***@beethoven.com
"point state", a closure reduced to one point, where even
mentioning the fact is "dangerous". But once the issue is exposed,
then
Post by f***@beethoven.com
a second idempotent closure operates in which any action gives the
same
Post by f***@beethoven.com
result: proof of guilt. Again, these mechanisms act as long as the
accuser is believed to be true and honest by virtue of being an
authority. This condition is essential, since basically it is the
accuser who gathers the evidence, and evidence can be easily
forged,
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
particularly if the whole process is planned in advance. For
instance,
Post by f***@beethoven.com
it is easy to collect evidence in advance and pretend it was found
in
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
the scene of the crime, including but not limited to corporal
debris,
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
fingerprints, objects left behind or stolen (small and apparently
innocuous, the kind that are not reported to the police), etc.
[It would be a cover, a tautology, not a closure, once the issue is
raised and the victim ends up being guilty no matter what; yet, if
there is a clearly established hypothesis of what indeed happened and
a
Post by f***@beethoven.com
clear exit for innocence before testing the hypothesis *and* a
dateline, then the basic good intention of the police can be accepted
as fact, because then the victim will be able to establish his
innocence; in other words, unless this conditions aren't met, the
victim has already been judged as guilty; this should be even more
important when dealing with international accusations: any
investigation has to be *fully* accomplished before any accusation;
investigating while observing and accusing is becoming accoplices by
letting do in case the victim is really guilty, or being
inquisitorial
Post by f***@beethoven.com
in case the victim is really innocent and the policehas criminal or
political intentions.]
Post by f***@beethoven.com
So the chin chin closure works by an authority taking the victim's
acts
Post by f***@beethoven.com
and committing crimes around them, with the supporting evidence
gathered as necessary to pretend that the victim is guilty,
particularly when the victim is accusing the victimizers!
Obviously,
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
this can be accompanied with the same arguments applied to other
people, other victims, either by convincing ("sensible"
reinterpretation making innocence appear as being contrived) or by
threats, bribes, etc.
The moral of this essay is that when it comes to dennounce crimes
all
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
aprties involved become automatically suspicious! But,
particularly,
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
the authority, as the simple fact of being authority lends it moral
weight which may not be really warranted. As always, moral probity
is
Post by f***@beethoven.com
a
Post by f***@beethoven.com
difficult issue but cannot be taken for granted.
Fabrizio J BOnsignore, now Danilo J Bonsignore
This essay is linked to the Double Entendre thread. The double
entendre
Post by f***@beethoven.com
in this case is a form of subtle identity theft.
Fabrizio J BOnsignore, now Danilo J Bonsignore
f***@beethoven.com
2005-05-27 21:14:27 UTC
Permalink
Other chin chin mechanism that's used is the enemies pretending to be
friends of the victim in front of would be friends/protectors to create
antagonism, and to pretend that any thing giving worth to the victim
was actually given by the enemies, so the victim endsup worthless in
both cases, in the former by looking like a rebel/betrayer/enemy and in
the latter by looking as a copy cat or an
opportunist/deceiver/fraudster (while at the same time the enemies take
possesion for themselves of the victim's worthies).

Danilo J. Bonsignore, then Fabrizio J. Bonsignore, again Danilo J.
Bonsignore
Post by f***@beethoven.com
"He himself implied": an expression of the chin chin mechanism after
informing of a future "reality" in the past tense...
Fabrizio J Bonsignore, now Danilo J Bonsignore
Post by f***@beethoven.com
As one of the tools applied in these mechanisms, it is possible to
setup pictures with similar;y looking people, taking advantage of the
granularity of films and lights and setups! Anybody can suddenly find
him/herself in pictures they know were never taken...
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
I attempted a formal language to explain without ambiguities how
the
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
confusion of identities works when, in spoken and even written
language
Post by f***@beethoven.com
it is impossible to disambiguate the confusion, as the phrase 'A is
(really" B' works for both identities. Yet this is but one of
various mechanism that can be used to exchange people. They are
called
Post by f***@beethoven.com
mechanisms since once established they operate automatically; once
the
Post by f***@beethoven.com
initial confusion is seeded it is just a matter of applying the
same
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
operation, and no matter how the victim reacts he/she will be
subject
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
to the effect of the mechanism, as long as the initial assumptions
are
Post by f***@beethoven.com
considered true.
The most simplified mechanism, employed by the Mexican armed forces
(includiing the various polices), is the "chin chin", also knows as
"la
Post by f***@beethoven.com
tuya"; (yours) or "all you say is backwards" (refers to you). I may
have already exposed it somewhere else, but I here I want to make
it
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
a) the party applying it has authority (authority fallacy or ad
baculum, asuming trth is derived from authority irrespective of
deductive logic)
b)the party applying it is committing the crimes or offenses that
will
Post by f***@beethoven.com
be blamed on the victim
Both conditions are necessary to apply successfully the mechanism,
condition a) to be believed and condition b) to incriminate. It
only
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
makes sense to apply it for criminal activities, not for positive
achievements, through the existence of positive works makes it more
profitable and often the motivation to apply it. (Note: this
confusion
Post by f***@beethoven.com
works best when dealing between countries, if the accusing country
establishes a false identity for the victim from the outset, as the
innocent victim will appear like he/she is committing a fraud).
But what really makes it work is to make the victim *hook* into the
mechanism through "self-incrimination". To make it credible, there
are
Post by f***@beethoven.com
1) inform the victim of all crimes committed to force him to deny
them
Post by f***@beethoven.com
('I didn't do it!')
2) take the victim's words and make them true in a criminal way
3) make criminals protect the victim, so that he/she appears as
being
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
an accomplice and/or as a traitor to the criminal bands.
The first path is rather tricky, as it involves informing the
victim
Post by f***@beethoven.com
in
Post by f***@beethoven.com
such a way he/she cannot accuse back. But once the suspicions that
he
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
may be incriminated is seeded, the second path is easier, as there
will
Post by f***@beethoven.com
be a natural incentive to explain and prevent the undesirable
consequences. This incrimination works under the assumption that
*raising an issue means admittance of guilt*. And once this
assumption
Post by f***@beethoven.com
is in place there is no way the victim can prove himself innocent!
Formally this has the meaning of a double closure. In one hand, at
the
Post by f***@beethoven.com
beginning of the process of applying the mechanism, the victim is
in
Post by f***@beethoven.com
a
Post by f***@beethoven.com
"point state", a closure reduced to one point, where even
mentioning the fact is "dangerous". But once the issue is exposed,
then
Post by f***@beethoven.com
a second idempotent closure operates in which any action gives the
same
Post by f***@beethoven.com
result: proof of guilt. Again, these mechanisms act as long as the
accuser is believed to be true and honest by virtue of being an
authority. This condition is essential, since basically it is the
accuser who gathers the evidence, and evidence can be easily
forged,
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
particularly if the whole process is planned in advance. For
instance,
Post by f***@beethoven.com
it is easy to collect evidence in advance and pretend it was found
in
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
the scene of the crime, including but not limited to corporal
debris,
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
fingerprints, objects left behind or stolen (small and apparently
innocuous, the kind that are not reported to the police), etc.
[It would be a cover, a tautology, not a closure, once the issue is
raised and the victim ends up being guilty no matter what; yet, if
there is a clearly established hypothesis of what indeed happened and
a
Post by f***@beethoven.com
clear exit for innocence before testing the hypothesis *and* a
dateline, then the basic good intention of the police can be accepted
as fact, because then the victim will be able to establish his
innocence; in other words, unless this conditions aren't met, the
victim has already been judged as guilty; this should be even more
important when dealing with international accusations: any
investigation has to be *fully* accomplished before any accusation;
investigating while observing and accusing is becoming accoplices by
letting do in case the victim is really guilty, or being
inquisitorial
Post by f***@beethoven.com
in case the victim is really innocent and the policehas criminal or
political intentions.]
Post by f***@beethoven.com
So the chin chin closure works by an authority taking the victim's
acts
Post by f***@beethoven.com
and committing crimes around them, with the supporting evidence
gathered as necessary to pretend that the victim is guilty,
particularly when the victim is accusing the victimizers!
Obviously,
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
this can be accompanied with the same arguments applied to other
people, other victims, either by convincing ("sensible"
reinterpretation making innocence appear as being contrived) or by
threats, bribes, etc.
The moral of this essay is that when it comes to dennounce crimes
all
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
aprties involved become automatically suspicious! But,
particularly,
Post by f***@beethoven.com
Post by f***@beethoven.com
the authority, as the simple fact of being authority lends it moral
weight which may not be really warranted. As always, moral probity
is
Post by f***@beethoven.com
a
Post by f***@beethoven.com
difficult issue but cannot be taken for granted.
Fabrizio J BOnsignore, now Danilo J Bonsignore
This essay is linked to the Double Entendre thread. The double
entendre
Post by f***@beethoven.com
in this case is a form of subtle identity theft.
Fabrizio J BOnsignore, now Danilo J Bonsignore
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